3-5-2 with Giaccherini on the wing?

[mackembhoy]

What's Bridcutt got to do with it? Buckley has the physicality and is defensively diligent but, yeah, he doesn't seem to be very good.

I suggested playing giacc as the other CM with Larsson.

Could effectively play, Juventus 352 of

Pants
Vergini O'Shea Brown
Larsson
Jones Johnson Giacc PVA
Defoe Fletcher​

 

[Midday Sun Englishman]

I suggested playing giacc as the other CM with Larsson.

Could effectively play, Juventus 352 of

Pants
Vergini O'Shea Brown
Larsson
Jones Johnson Giacc PVA
Defoe Fletcher​

I think Larsson in the holding role is an interesting thought.

 

[Sunderland Surfer]

It's all too bloody complicated for me. Id just like to see AJ, Giac, Alvarez and Defoe all on the pitch together. There's you threat, now build the rest of the team around that!!

Not complicated at all if you set up as 4231 and tell the frontb4 they have NO defensive duties.

 

[Cack Stottie]

Daniel Alves can't defend but has been one of the best wing backs in the world.

Have you really just compared Dani Alves to Giaccherini?

 

[Timsafc]

Have you really just compared Dani Alves to Giaccherini?

No just used him to emphasise that the wing back role is about more about attacking than defending.

 

[Bud The Horse]

Think PVA has been one of our better players this season so would be harsh to drop him but it would be nice to see Giaccherini intergrated into the side somewhere where he can finally be effective after 18 months on the periphery.

What have you been watching or do you just look at the results and see that he's scored a couple?

He's a defensive nightmare but when in a 3-5-2 he's too scared to play in midfield meaning we're just playing a lop sided 4-4-2

 

[Cack Stottie]

No just used him to emphasise that the wing back role is about more about attacking than defending.

Apart from we are Sunderland, not Barcelona, and Dani Alves has always been primarily a right back, whereas Giaccherini is a very weak, not very fast, winger that struggles with the physicality in this league.

You'd have been better off comparing him to Dossena or something.

 

[Timsafc]

What have you been watching or do you just look at the results and see that he's scored a couple?

He's a defensive nightmare but when in a 3-5-2 he's too scared to play in midfield meaning we're just playing a lop sided 4-4-2

Got nothing to do with goals. Was playing well before injury and then was man of the match in his comeback game.

Apart from we are Sunderland, not Barcelona, and Dani Alves has always been primarily a right back, whereas Giaccherini is a very weak, not very fast, winger that struggles with the physicality in this league.

You'd have been better off comparing him to Dossena or something.

I wasn't comparing them so don't know why you even bring up Dossena. Teams that aren't Barca also have attacking wing backs too.

 

[Bud The Horse]

Got nothing to do with goals. Was playing well before injury and then was man of the match in his comeback game.

He's utter shite pal, there's a reason Chelsea thought better than to keep hold of him. People who pick MoM don't have a clue sometimes.

 

[GK]

The only times I'd seen Giaccherini before he signed for us he was playing wingback. In fact when he signed I thought it was to play wingback.

Where has he played wing back?

 

[Ilios]

He's utter shite pal, there's a reason Chelsea thought better than to keep hold of him. People who pick MoM don't have a clue sometimes.

Yep, and those reasons are Cesar Azpilicueta and Filipe Luis. Not good enough to play for the best team in England - therefore not good enough for Sunderland. Logical arguments have been better prepared, I must say.

 

[Timsafc]

He's utter shite pal, there's a reason Chelsea thought better than to keep hold of him. People who pick MoM don't have a clue sometimes.

Everyone who went to the Leeds game could see that he was MOM. Couple below par games lately and he is shite. Not saying he is brilliant otherwise he would still be at Chelsea but we aren't a top of the league side. He's been part of what's been a pretty solid defence this season & gives us pace and balance down the left.

 

[Bud The Horse]

Everyone who went to the Leeds game could see that he was MOM. Couple below par games lately and he is shite. Not saying he is brilliant otherwise he would still be at Chelsea but we aren't a top of the league side. He's been part of what's been a pretty solid defence this season & gives us pace and balance down the left.

1 half decent game against a championship team, out of however many games he's played this season...... A good player this does not make.

I need not explain my views, i know what i've seen from him & i've seen enough to know he'll be on premier league wages for years (because of his pace) despite being a championship player at best.

Not fussed who's on the wing in this formation really, the 3-5-2 doesn't fly for me. (Pun intended)

 

[Edmonton Oilers 99]

I think Giach should be sold.

I've been very disappointed with him and would probably agree.

I don't like the system with 3 at the back, I think it's bollocks especially as we are short of good centre halves anyway.
I've also never seen Giacc play wing back, and there has been nothing in his game that would make me think he'd be good there.
But regardless of the above, he has played that position for Juventus and Italy, so maybe we're all wrong and he'd be a revelation playing there.

 

[Perryqhill]

He played there once for Italy in his first game IIRC, they didn't usually use wing backs, but fullbacks. Don't think he played there at all for Juve.

Not complicated at all if you set up as 4231 and tell the frontb4 they have NO defensive duties.

Virtually no team in the world plays like that though. There's freedom and then there's just being silly.

 

[Ilios]

He played there once for Italy in his first game IIRC, they didn't usually use wing backs, but fullbacks. Don't think he played there at all for Juve.



Virtually no team in the world plays like that though. There's freedom and then there's just being silly.

Bayern Munich and Real Madrid have both won the CL playing 4-2-3-1 in the last 2 years.

 

[Perryqhill]

Bayern Munich and Real Madrid have both won the CL playing 4-2-3-1 in the last 2 years.

True. But several things differ with those sides in comparison to us - for instance all four players in those positions are generally World Class or thereabouts and have quality behind them, meaning those sides can cope and especially in Bayern's case they aren't free from defensive duties anyway - they're extremely hardworking, play at a high intensity and defend as a team. I see nothing wrong with the idea of the 4231 formation, but rather the mad idea you could say that four of the outfield 10 are free from any defensive duties, when that doesn't happen anywhere and would lead to us being pressed high out and outnumbered mostly, as we don't have the type of quality needed to outscore everyone else.

 

[Ilios]

True. But several things differ with those sides in comparison to us - for instance all four players in those positions are generally World Class or thereabouts and have quality behind them, meaning those sides can cope and especially in Bayern's case they aren't free from defensive duties anyway - they're extremely hardworking, play at a high intensity and defend as a team. I see nothing wrong with the idea of the 4231 formation, but rather the mad idea you could say that four of the outfield 10 are free from any defensive duties, when that doesn't happen anywhere and would lead to us being pressed high out and outnumbered mostly, as we don't have the type of quality needed to outscore everyone else.

Quite right, but I never suggested they were. One of the great achievements of Heynckes Bayern Munich side, was that he got Robben & Ribery tracking back as the wide players in 4-2-3-1. They did though, play inverted but stayed very wide and high, stretching the pitch during attacks. Real Madrid with players like Ronaldo, Di Maria, Bale etc have also done the same. When we've played 4-3-3, our 'wide forwards' have tended to play far too narrow and deep to be able to make the formation work, particularly as 1 of those was a 6'3 CF playing out left.

 

[pwsafc]

He's played both, I'd say he would have played in the 3 man midfield more and the reason I'd like to see us play it with him on saturday.

Pants
Vergini O'Shea Brown
Jones Larsson Giacc PVA
Johnson
Defoe Wickham​

Thats why you play 3 CBs to allow the wingbacks to attack.

Yes but there a reason they are called wingbacks and not wingers, they need to defend as much as they attack

 

[Perryqhill]

Quite right, but I never suggested they were. One of the great achievements of Heynckes Bayern Munich side, was that he got Robben & Ribery tracking back as the wide players in 4-2-3-1. They did though, play inverted but stayed very wide and high, stretching the pitch during attacks. Real Madrid with players like Ronaldo, Di Maria, Bale etc have also done the same. When we've played 4-3-3, our 'wide forwards' have tended to play far too narrow and deep to be able to make the formation work, particularly as 1 of those was a 6'3 CF playing out left.

You didn't but the poster who I was replying to, which you quoted was, hence me making the initial post. I think the formation would maybe suit our attacking players and it's worth a try, though I can't see the manager using it.

I think the main difference with what we have and what they have is pace and energy in those areas, forgetting the obvious quality. Strangely enough when playing that way this season I actually think that six foot three centre forward made a better fist of it than any of the wingers, given he has a bit of pace and strength which the others don't and it meant although he needs a kick up the arse at times, makes poor decisions and isn't always are he got us up the pitch at times and actually managed to link with the front man.