BILLY BUS PASS
Midfield
When ya run a company first thing you are told is don’t fukk with the vat man they are ruthless.
Not Guilty of Murder -Kieran Williams Trial Verdict
- Thread starter fulwellfred
- Start date
The soap powder
Winger
He had history though and showed no remorse as well as telling lie upon lie, he will do most of his time in mental health wing
nah what was said ?
Dun Scathach
Midfield
Became an alcoholic as a result of serious sexual assaults by a group of men whilst a child.
When you put the anger and the behaviour he showed from that point forward, including his previous conviction into that context then it’s a horror story.
The soap powder
Winger
Yeah think he was a complexed young man, He was a foster child took in by a family i know and he has never been easy
he caused them lots of problems over the years
Dun Scathach
Midfield
Something is so far wrong with the system when kids who have been anywhere near the care system, even as limited as his was, disproportionately end up in prison and we haven’t yet worked out how to combat it. We know the warning signs and we know why but we can’t prevent it.
38% of the UK adult prison population are previously looked after children. Less than 1% of the general population are looked after. It’s nuts.
I feel so sorry for his family, they seem like really decent folk. Those poor people. As much as people rightly feel it should be, prison will be exceptionally difficult for him.
That’s before we even get to thinking about the victims family.
The soap powder
Winger
Yeah its one big huge mess, The police have been out to this lad lots of time over the years he has attacked his foster parents and tore the family to bits but looks like he never really got any good help.
On the other side of this the way he lied and lied about stabbing this lad was horrific and so he deserves to be punished and off our streets as he would do it again.
Yeah the victims family i do feel sorry for because all their son did wrong was meet an absolute horrific individual
Dun Scathach
Midfield
Awful mate. Having behaved that way and I’m guessing pushed the family away I can not see him surviving prison.
I know plenty will disagree but how do we as a society create this and people like this man.
Jabberwocky
Winger
Don’t fuck with the tax man…. Unless you’re a Tory donor
The soap powder
Winger
Unfortunately him and thousands others go under the radar or become too high maintenance to look after so they are left alone
Also the metal health support for people in this country is horrific with long waiting lists seen as the normal
CPLforever
Midfield
Not saying there aren't problems in the care system cos there is but is this cause and effect or effect and cause if you know what I mean. The care system by its very nature have brought into it children from troubled backgrounds and broken and chaotic homes and generally they are taken from family who cannot or choose not to cope but are family nevertheless.
From my experience the care service and care workers especially do the best job they can but in many cases are just fire fighting and cannot compete with poor history, poor family structures, peer pressure and sometimes just damaged children who have learned nothing but how to cause damage themselves.
The high percentages of care experienced young people in prison is not a statistic that tells us much initself because how many of these young people would have entered the system if they hadn't been put into care.
Swindon On Tour
Striker
Always somebody else’s problem.
Root cause never adequately dealt with. I despair with the fabric of this Country and as a Father of two young decent well brought up lads I fear that they ever come across scum like this.
Nobody wins in any of this just once again a tragedy. How do you move on from this?
Because I don’t think I could right now.
Root cause never adequately dealt with. I despair with the fabric of this Country and as a Father of two young decent well brought up lads I fear that they ever come across scum like this.
Nobody wins in any of this just once again a tragedy. How do you move on from this?
Because I don’t think I could right now.
Dun Scathach
Midfield
Clear your inbox mate.
Oh they will, and all of our children will increasingly. Because we no longer fund or care for prevention.
You can’t have a safe and progressive society without addressing the causes and doing so properly.
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DisillusionedOldGit
Winger
Too right. Remember the court case that had to be halted because no-one on the jury knew what "coerce" meant ? Mind that was before it was popular
Dun Scathach
Midfield
It’s not the care workers. As a care home operator, much smaller now that I used to be but at my peak, I employed a little over 200 people. I’m expected to recruit and retain the best at a little over minimum wage.
Little over minimum wage to work with societies most vulnerable and at risk children and adults. When these people deserve a pay rate double that. Care work should be a vocation and we should be attracting the very brightest and best. But we just can’t. They go to work in Amazon instead for higher wages without the spiralling pressure.
I don’t pay them close to minimum wage so I can keep the profit and buy a yacht, I pay them close to minimum wage because the council pay lower and lower rates to providers. (With the exception of private children’s social care where absolutely, the operators are taking excessive profits and delivering worse outcomes post COVID. It’s the Wild West)
On your final paragraph, we know unequivocally that where young people are raised in a stable household, with access to education and early intervention they go on to become functioning adults as you point out just before then.
You’re spot on and it comes back to the issue of are bad people born or are they created. We know again that they are created as a result of environment, trauma or just outright shite luck.
My experience, and I’ve worked with government and national bodies on this is that in my lifetime, 1980s and onwards, we care less and less about society, we want to take care of ourselves and our own and we have been conditioned to less and less want to point money at poor people or particularly the people who need it. Of course there is a middle ground, but these are the consequences.
Take a look around. Everything is creaking and people and crimes like these are the consequences.
zinedine
Striker
Yes it looks like that's what has happened. I'm not sure why they are blaming each other though if a third party actually killed him. Why don't they just say who did it? Fear?
The jury are getting the blame on this thread but the jury are led by the judge. If there's no proof they murdered him then the jury can't find them guilty of murder. For me just them being part of his killing, they should get the sentence that they would have got if they had actually murdered him. They should have got a lot more time than they did. The system is broken.
columbo70
Central Defender
One thing for sure is the case of Kieran Williams is an injustice.....the police will have a very good idea who was involved and what went on...but when 2 young lads confess to it then blame each other , it was always going to be a difficult one for the force to prove.
It was like one of those Mafia stories when someone takes the rap , says nowt and does the time.....comes out as a hero to the criminals involved. Ive seen a crime programme recently from America where this exact same scenario played out....confess to being there but blame each other.....it then goes to the jury and where there is Reasonable Doubt they all got acquitted.
Its my belief ,the 2 young lads where coerced into confessing and blaming each other....they knew that with the age of the 2 and doubt behind who did the stabbing then they were always going to get lighter sentences. I do believe according to the Sunderland Echo the police have not closed this case.....i think the true story will one day come out when someone has their arse on the line and seeks protection or a lighter sentence for grassing. Plus the families , friends and gangs involved will always be looking over the shoulder at revenge attacks or being bribed from people knowing the truth. Although it may seem that people have got away with this ,it will linger , fester and cause grief for years to come
It was like one of those Mafia stories when someone takes the rap , says nowt and does the time.....comes out as a hero to the criminals involved. Ive seen a crime programme recently from America where this exact same scenario played out....confess to being there but blame each other.....it then goes to the jury and where there is Reasonable Doubt they all got acquitted.
Its my belief ,the 2 young lads where coerced into confessing and blaming each other....they knew that with the age of the 2 and doubt behind who did the stabbing then they were always going to get lighter sentences. I do believe according to the Sunderland Echo the police have not closed this case.....i think the true story will one day come out when someone has their arse on the line and seeks protection or a lighter sentence for grassing. Plus the families , friends and gangs involved will always be looking over the shoulder at revenge attacks or being bribed from people knowing the truth. Although it may seem that people have got away with this ,it will linger , fester and cause grief for years to come
The soap powder
Winger
Swindon On Tour
Striker
Absolutely depressing reading that because you are spot on.
Lumber
Midfield
Him who slashed him has 2 older brothers, bother proper lunatics, the mar n dar are also loan sharks/dealers.... not saying they are involved in this like
Less, been remanded which goes towards sentance
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