I hope we take a best practice commercial approach to appointing the Head Coach

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the streaker said:
think you will find Arneson was SD at Hamburg from the date you quote and LC was TD underneath him so he wasn't calling the shots...............

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Congerton
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ok; fair point . but its not as if his job was to guard the bee in the glass jar whilst FA did all the other work now is it?
Why not just wait and see and start considering the positive work the LC has done in the last 12 months instead the usual SMB bedwetting about something that hasnt happened yet
 


TopCat said:
ok; fair point . but its not as if his job was to guard the bee in the glass jar whilst FA did all the other work now is it?
Why not just wIt and see and start considering te positive work the LC has done in the last 12 months instead the usual SMB bedwetting about something that hasnt happened yet
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Unconvinced mate you can spin things everyway but Rodwell and his lack of experience doesn't inspire me..........

Football is a cut throat short term game and I don't want someone cutting his teeth in such a position here ........
 
the streaker said:
Unconvinced mate you can spin things everyway but Rodwell and his lack of experience doesn't inspire me..........

Football is a cut throat short term game and I don't want someone cutting his teeth in such a position here ........
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well if you have an anti-congerton agenda as you seem to have then I fully expect you to highlight the poor signings (Rodwell) but suggest Poyet was responsible for the signings that worked...
 
i think they might surprise us. getting Dick Advocaat was down to congerton. none of us are privvy to any sort of list they may or may not have.
 
TopCat said:
well if you have an anti-congerton agenda as you seem to have then I fully expect you to highlight the poor signings (Rodwell) but suggest Poyet was responsible for the signings that worked...
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Nothing wrong with doubting his experience for this job which I do..................

I only mentioned Poyet in knowing Defoe I said nothing about him and any other signings..........clearly he must have had a big say in the likes of Buckley and Bridcutt...........

What I do know is who signed Rodwell and pissed £10 million up the wall though..........
 
Lanchesterredandwhite said:
So don't read what I post is one option.

The Arnesen link is hardly tenuous is it - Advocaat himself confirmed that the contact came from Arnesen, Congerton's other mate, acting on behalf of SAFC.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...-sunderland-job-three-weeks-ago-10124370.html
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It is, everyone in football will use a network, most in that network will be friends (referring to them as 'his mate' is just a petty attempt to belittle the bloke). To suggest Congerton only appoints his friends is nonsense as proven by his one and only appointment so far, someone who wasn't his friend. 100% of the sample we can look at suggests you're talking shite.
Going through Arnesson is hardly a stick to beat him with either (let alone repeatedly, on every thread, whether relevant or not), it got us Advocaat, a resounding success so who cares how he ended up here. He used someone he knew knew him to make the initial contact, not sure how that's wrong. I'm sure if you dissected the majority of appointments or transfers made (which you wouldn't unless you had an agenda) then you'd find similar links. I'd rather our DoF wasn't so arrogant as to think he knows it all and was willing to seek advice and use a decent network of contacts to make the right appointment, again something he has done every time he's tried so far.
 
the streaker said:
Nothing wrong with doubting his experience for this job which I do..................

I only mentioned Poyet in knowing Defoe I said nothing about him and any other signings..........clearly he must have had a big say in the likes of Buckley and Bridcutt...........

What I do know is who signed Rodwell and pissed £10 million up the wall though..........
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And do we know who it was how suggested Rodwell? How do you know that Congerton wasn't acting on direct instructions from Poyet? Certainly all the other signings from last year have a Poyet slant on them - Coates, Alvarez, Gomez, Buckley, Bridcutt etc
I know the SD is supposed to have final say (allegedly) but don't forget how high GP's stock was last summer. The only decisions we know that LC was 100% making on his own were the sacking of Poyet and the hiring of Advocaat.
 
TopCat said:
And do we know who it was how suggested Rodwell? How do you know that Congerton wasn't acting on direct instructions from Poyet? Certainly all the other signings from last year have a Poyet slant on them - Coates, Alvarez, Gomez, Buckley, Bridcutt etc
I know the SD is supposed to have final say (allegedly) but don't forget how high GP's stock was last summer. The only decisions we know that LC was 100% making on his own were the sacking of Poyet and the hiring of Advocaat.
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Because mate I do............only one transfer but I do.........
 
CARLOS CLASS said:
Looking at some of the recent appointments, it is difficult to envisage a set of sensible past performance and leadership criteria to manage SAFC that were satisfied by the likes of PDC etc.

I really hope the club are going to be much more forensic in their examination of candidates versus a carefully thought out profile for the ideal appointment.

Question is - is there anyone at the club capable of such thinking, detailed preparation and professional execution?
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Yes, Short will have asked Dick for his input (I Hope).
 
Jasper said:
Who brought Advocaat to the club like?
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And Rodwell............

hes been in the job for 5 minutes and I would prefer someone with a bit more experience thanks..........

Lets see who we get as full time manager as being brutally honest Ellis Short has appointed the tweo previous ones with a brief to keep us up and they did.........
 
the streaker said:
Because mate I do............only one transfer but I do.........
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If you say so. Even if you DO have inside info, accountability and responsibility are built on shifting sands - as soon as it appeared that the Rodwell may have been a poor signing (jury is still out in my opinion) then Poyet being Poyet no doubt absolved himself from all responsibility even though he has final say on transfers - it was stated last summer that he didn't have to sign any player he didn't want

the streaker said:
hes been in the job for 5 minutes and I would prefer someone with a bit more experience thanks...........
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Just as well it's not your choice then as you appear to be in the minority
 
Howard the Duck said:
It is, everyone in football will use a network, most in that network will be friends. To suggest Congerton only appoints his friends is nonsense as proven by his one and only appointment so far, someone who wasn't his friend. 100% of the sample we can look at suggests you're talking shite.
Going through Arnesson is hardly a stick to beat him with either (let alone repeatedly, on every thread, whether relevant or not), it got us Advocaat, a resounding success so who cares how we ended up here. He used someone he knew knew him to make the initial contact, not sure how that's wrong. I'm sure if you dissected the majority of appointments or transfers made (which you wouldn't unless you had an agenda) then you'd find similar links. I'd rather our DoF wasn't so arrogant as to think he knows it all and was willing to seek advice and use a decent network of contacts to make the right appointment, again something he has done every time he's tried so far.
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The link to Arnesen is hardly 'tenuous at best' though is it when Advocaat has confirmed it in public, and it was Arnesen who effectively offered Advocaat the job (as proven by Advocaat). Do you actually know what 'tenuous' means?

The problem is that now Advocaat has left, we are left looking for a manager who will fit a model overseen by a DoF with a very unimpressive track record. If you want a DoF with contacts, I'd rather someone who had a genuinely global network of top contacts, so that we could get the right man for the job. Instead we have a DoF whose first appointment was based on ringing his ex-boss for help, and whose second looks like it will be to appoint a coach who he used to work with in Chelsea's Under 16s a few years ago.
 
Football is more like war than business, business is easier because even though it's competitive businesses rarely have to literally fight one another (there is a degree of that head hunting, industrial espionage etc) whereas in football it's all out direct competition with 19 opponents. So whatever makes a good (little) General is what's required - leadership (moral courage), organisation (squad development & training) and most of all vision (style of play and tactical flair). I don't envy the club.
 
Lanchesterredandwhite said:
The link to Arnesen is hardly 'tenuous at best' though is it when Advocaat has confirmed it in public, and it was Arnesen who effectively offered Advocaat the job (as proven by Advocaat). Do you actually know what 'tenuous' means?

The problem is that now Advocaat has left, we are left looking for a manager who will fit a model overseen by a DoF with a very unimpressive track record. If you want a DoF with contacts, I'd rather someone who had a genuinely global network of top contacts, so that we could get the right man for the job. Instead we have a DoF whose first appointment was based on ringing his ex-boss for help, and whose second looks like it will be to appoint a coach who he used to work with in Chelsea's Under 16s a few years ago.
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Pure agenda ridden conjecture. You keep screaming about it on every thread so at least someone has acknowledged it and given it some attention now.
I know exactly what tenuous means, don't be so pompous. The Arnesson thing you keep dragging up is tenuous to the context of what I was pointing out, which was you saying Congerton only appoints his friends.
 
Howard the Duck said:
Pure agenda ridden conjecture. You keep screaming about it on every thread so at least someone has acknowledged it and given it some attention now.
I know exactly what tenuous means, don't be so pompous. The Arnesson thing you keep dragging up is tenuous to the context of what I was pointing out, which was you saying Congerton only appoints his friends.
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It's not conjecture though is it - Advocaat confirmed that it was fact that Arnesen contacted Advocaat.

TopCat said:
Care to expand on that? (He's Sporting Director BTW)
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There is nothing in Congerton's CV or track record which is impressive. I can't really think of another way of putting it. Which bits of his CV are you impressed by?
 
Lanchesterredandwhite said:
It's not conjecture though is it - Advocaat confirmed that it was fact that Arnesen contacted Advocaat.



There is nothing in Congerton's CV or track record which is impressive. I can't really think of another way of putting it. Which bits of his CV are you impressed by?
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Signing Pantillimon, van Aanholt, Coates, Gomez & Defoe
Renewing the contract of Seb Larsson (POTY)
Negotiating the swap of Altidore & Defoe
Sacking Poyet
Hiring Advocaat
 
TopCat said:
If you say so. Even if you DO have inside info, accountability and responsibility are built on shifting sands - as soon as it appeared that the Rodwell may have been a poor signing (jury is still out in my opinion) then Poyet being Poyet no doubt absolved himself from all responsibility even though he has final say on transfers - it was stated last summer that he didn't have to sign any player he didn't want



Just as well it's not your choice then as you appear to be in the minority
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did mate ............Congerton signed him period despite what you then try and twist into it.................

And trying to paint it as if Congerton is deeply valued and we all think hes doing a good job doesn't wash at all........theres as many unconvinced about a bloke whose never really been much more than a glorified scout until we gave him a top seat here...........
 
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