religion. what is the point?

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Ilios said:
Which applies to all gods, ever. Welcome to reality ;)
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No sir, God is the origin of everything, in Christian tradition.
Ilios said:
Ok then. Define the terms of this God...


Which applies to all gods, ever. Welcome to reality ;)
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God is the creator of all things. According to Christians. He wasn't made. He precedes time.
 


Lewberry pie said:
Again pinz you're taking scripture out of context to fit am argument, for example the rape and his victim isn't right, just off the top of my head, they were forced to marry cause they'd been bucking, not cause he'd raped her. Try not to be so willing to accept everything you hear from evil bible. Com ;)
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Exodus 21-30 & again in Deuteronomy 'God' specifically tells us that we can enslave other humans, how much we should pay for them, that we can beat them as long as they don't die within 2 days (if they die after that, fine). It gives specific instructions for male/female and jew/non-jew slaves, and that you can actually pass slavces down to children as property.

Also, the passage above is rape. Read it.
 
Ilios said:
If it exists beyond any comprehension, why do you assume it is a 'being'?
Did it create everything?
Does it intervene or answer prayers?
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It's not beyond our comprehension, it just isn't bound by the rules we are. I think I've just explained what God is anyway, or have I not? Can you explain why the last 2 questions are relevant to my definition of God?

Ilios said:
Exodus 21-30 & again in Deuteronomy 'God' specifically tells us that we can enslave other humans, how much we should pay for them, that we can beat them as long as they don't die within 2 days (if they die after that, fine). It gives specific instructions for male/female and jew/non-jew slaves, and that you can actually pass slavces down to children as property.

Also, the passage above is rape. Read it.
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Because that was the culture of the time, perhaps God just created a guide for people with slaves rather than destroying the culture of the time.

And as I've said, the Hebrew probably means lay down rather than rape but even in that case it's not condoning the action, simply recording what happened.
 
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Lewberry pie said:
I'm not sure how you've reached that conclusion, also the other thing to remember is there's some parts of the bible which record what happened, it doesn't mean the actions are condoned
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Not condoned? What?

If it's not condoned that a rape victim has to marry her rapist, then why does your bible state that she has to marry her rapist?

Lewberry pie said:
It's not beyond our comprehension, it just isn't bound by the rules we are. I think I've just explained what God is anyway, or have I not? Can you explain why the last 2 questions are relevant to my definition of God?


Because that was the culture of the time, perhaps God just created a guide for people with slaves rather than destroying the culture of the time.

And as I've said, the Hebrew probably means lay down rather than rape but even in that case it's not condoning the action, simply recording what happened.
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No it doesn't.
 
Randy Ostrich said:
We really spend the rest of our lives trying to silence, edit or censor ourselves. You would think consciousness and identity are wonderful things yet we beat ourselves over the head with them, telling ourselves that we aren't good enough or clever enough or slim enough.

We do it as a species too. Human hands can't have built the pyramids, it must've been aliens! Then you think there's a little strip of New York, a city with the most expensive land on the planet, devoted to being a meeting place for all nations to come together, and allows do is slag it off.

The one unfailing human trait is putting ourselves down.
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That's the nature of mind. Never accepting things as they are. Putting up barriers to protect our soft inner core. Believing we are unworthy of experiencing the supreme, our own inner nature...what we really are.....our own true self that has been there since the beginning when we took our first breath. That experience of bliss when our consciousness and reality met without the distraction of mind. If religion cannot take me back to that complete and perfect experience, then it is no religion at all. We've been there, we know it exists but the mind out of fear of that emptiness will do everything it can to distract us, even to the point of fantasying that the supreme is external.
 
Kubicki's right boot said:
No sir, God is the origin of everything, in Christian tradition.

God is the creator of all things. According to Christians. He wasn't made. He precedes time.
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Creation requires the paradigm of 'time', therefore a timeless creator is a logical fallacy. It is also special pleading to assert that your specific god is exempt from rules that govern everything else. To state that God is beyond rational capability, is to completely denounce Christianity in its entirety. It would be like accepting we live in a 2D world, and yet claim some people in a backwater of Judaea managed to walk off the page in a 3rd dimension, 2000 years ago, and somehow know the chartacteristics, name and personality of something that would be absolutely impossible for anybody to ever perceive. Also, if he precedes time, then he has no perception of it, and couldn't be interventionist.
 
AlpineExile said:
Not condoned? What?

If it's not condoned that a rape victim has to marry her rapist, then why does your bible state that she has to marry her rapist?
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Well I'd have to read it again including the original Hebrew, but it wasn't a command it was an incident that happened and was recored, and I'm not convinced it actually says rape in the original language, obviously anyone who wants the bible to be an evil book would be keen to see it one way.

Ilios said:
Creation requires the paradigm of 'time', therefore a timeless creator is a logical fallacy. It is also special pleading to assert that your specific god is exempt from rules that govern everything else. To state that God is beyond rational capability, is to completely denounce Christianity in its entirety. It would be like accepting we live in a 2D world, and yet claim some people in a backwater of Judaea managed to walk off the page in a 3rd dimension, 2000 years ago, and somehow know the chartacteristics, name and personality of something that would be absolutely impossible for anybody to ever perceive. Also, if he precedes time, then he has no perception of it, and couldn't be interventionist.
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He's not bound by time, there's no reason to assume he isn't aware of it, and the backwater judeans had Jesus, what's so complicated about it?
 
Kubicki's right boot said:
Got nothing to do with the law, unless you believe the only reason not to steal is that you might end arrested if you're caught. That wouldn't surprise me given your second sentence. Though shall not steal unless you're really short that month.
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No, I'm not sure if you're being wilfully obtuse or not :confused:

I'm saying how you can't necessarily have a moral absolute
 
Rather than being created by some supreme being I find it more likely that we're in some advanced version of the Sims game. In reality (if that's what it is) I find supernatural by definition isn't natural and therefore has no bearing on my actual life.

That whole statement is probably a contradiction. :)

Trying to be nice to people gets me through life in the least painless way possible. I think that's enough......maybe.....who knows!

I suppose 'why' (or at least asking) makes us human.
 
Lewberry pie said:
It's not beyond our comprehension, it just isn't bound by the rules we are. I think I've just explained what God is anyway, or have I not? Can you explain why the last 2 questions are relevant to my definition of God?


Because that was the culture of the time, perhaps God just created a guide for people with slaves rather than destroying the culture of the time.

And as I've said, the Hebrew probably means lay down rather than rape but even in that case it's not condoning the action, simply recording what happened.
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God states in the OT that he is unchanging, so if slavery was acceptable then it would be now. Jesus was also perfectly ok with slavery.
Exactly, it written by men of it's time, as a justification for men of it's time.
 
Lewberry pie said:
Well I'd have to read it again including the original Hebrew, but it wasn't a command it was an incident that happened and was recored, and I'm not convinced it actually says rape in the original language, obviously anyone who wants the bible to be an evil book would be keen to see it one way.


He's not bound by time, there's no reason to assume he isn't aware of it, and the backwater judeans had Jesus, what's so complicated about it?
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Does he intervene?
Does anything happen that he has no control over?
Did he create everything?
 
Lewberry pie said:
Does he?
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John 1:1 - 'In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.' If God IS the word, he is unchanging. Likewise Jesus (who was also his own father) said he was the ' same yesterday, tomorrow, and for all time'.
Now perhaps you could actually define your terms, eventually...
 
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