Ched Evans to train with Sheffield United

[Sweeper]

SUFC clearly want to re-employ him but are prevented from doing so by the media circus that has been whipped up by the feminist/politically correct brigade. He's being hammered for being an "unrepentant" rapist when the reason he is unrepentant could very well be that he is not guilty. People don't like to consider that possibility but it is very much in play.

Notwithstanding, the question of his lack of repentance is completely irrelevant because he has served his time and that lack of repentance will have been considered at sentencing. He has, whichever way you look at it, paid his debt to society for both his crime and his lack of repentance. He should now be free to get on with his life without a load of PC idiots looking to ruin what's left of it and/or a list of C-list celebrities looking to self-publicise by jumping on the anti-Evans bandwagon. I'm cynical, but it wouldn't suprise me at all if the media were made aware of all of these "celebrity patrons" cutting ties with SUFC even before the club were.

 

[Purrfect South]

He's hardly Jimmy Savile. He shagged an adult who, in his opinion had consented to sex, yet in the opinion of the judiciary was over some invisible line where she was incapable of consent.

If guilty, which I doubt, he's not in the same league as Luke McCormick, who is freely plying his trade.

The big difference here is the case has become a hobby-horse for feminists.

Fuck off with your feminist clap trap. There's plenty of decent lasses who feel strongly about this without having to be rampant feminists. That kind of comment says more about you than anything.

 

[smoker]

SUFC clearly want to re-employ him but are prevented from doing so by the media circus that has been whipped up by the feminist/politically correct brigade. He's being hammered for being an "unrepentant" rapist when the reason he is unrepentant could very well be that he is not guilty. People don't like to consider that possibility but it is very much in play.

Notwithstanding, the question of his lack of repentance is completely irrelevant because he has served his time and that lack of repentance will have been considered at sentencing. He has, whichever way you look at it, paid his debt to society for both his crime and his lack of repentance. He should now be free to get on with his life without a load of PC idiots looking to ruin what's left of it and/or a list of C-list celebrities looking to self-publicise by jumping on the anti-Evans bandwagon. I'm cynical, but it wouldn't suprise me at all if the media were made aware of all of these "celebrity patrons" cutting ties with SUFC even before the club were.

Bang on.

 

[not spavin]

SUFC clearly want to re-employ him but are prevented from doing so by the media circus that has been whipped up by the feminist/politically correct brigade. He's being hammered for being an "unrepentant" rapist when the reason he is unrepentant could very well be that he is not guilty. People don't like to consider that possibility but it is very much in play.

Notwithstanding, the question of his lack of repentance is completely irrelevant because he has served his time and that lack of repentance will have been considered at sentencing. He has, whichever way you look at it, paid his debt to society for both his crime and his lack of repentance. He should now be free to get on with his life without a load of PC idiots looking to ruin what's left of it and/or a list of C-list celebrities looking to self-publicise by jumping on the anti-Evans bandwagon. I'm cynical, but it wouldn't suprise me at all if the media were made aware of all of these "celebrity patrons" cutting ties with SUFC even before the club were.

Not defending a rapist = politically correct?

Really?

 

[Mel Be Mine]

Sensible decision from Utd. This argument about him being allowed to continue his trade is so flawed. If anyone in a high profile job had been convicted of such a heinous crime, they'd have to accept that career was over. It's unpalatable for someone in a position of trust to continue after a rape conviction- politician, doctor, copper, entertainer or footballer. By all means carry on with his life but keep your head down and stay out of the limelight would be my advice.

Really good post that mate, and spot on. Proven rape is rape. Ignore the sentence or curtailing of it, he is a convicted rapist. For that fact alone, he should be vilified and treat as the sick individual he is.

 

[not spavin]

I think the crux of the matter is that the justice system in this country is pathetic, Evans was found to be guilty by a jury of his peers, was subsequently sentenced to five years in prison and is then released after serving half of his sentence. If he'd served the full term I doubt a career in football on his release would have been an option.
Not being an expert can anyone explain his early release seeing as he has reportedly shown no remorse for his crime?
Arguments that he can't show remorse for a crime he claims he's not guilty of are irrelevant, I'm asking how under the circumstances he was released early?

There's a persistent misunderstanding about how sentences are constructed.

Evans got 5 years. He'd have got less had he entered a not guilt verdict / shown remorse.

That's not 5 years in prison. It's 5 years on licence. He was eligible for parole after half his sentence, and was granted it on the basis of good behaviour. His lack of contrition would only be a if it was felt that there was a risk of him embarking on a reprisal attack.

 

[smoker]

Fuck off with your feminist clap trap. There's plenty of decent lasses who feel strongly about this without having to be rampant feminists. That kind of comment says more about you than anything.

And plenty of women take the opposite angle:

http://www.theguardian.com/media/sh...udy-finnigan-please-dont-apologise-ched-evans

Fuck off yourself.

 

[Sweeper]

Not defending a rapist = politically correct?

Really?

That's not what I have said there, is it?!

Suggesting he cannot get on with his life as it would "send a message to kids that it's ok" is, yes. It's a ridiculous to say that him playing football is going to in any way make young people more likely to become rapists. Absent of that non-argument, there's no other reason for him to not be allowed to get on with his life. The fact is that he has served his time - if there's going to be some sort of kangaroo court now that gets to pass a second sentence on him, then we might as well not bother with the criminal justice system at all.

 

[not spavin]

Yawn. So pissed she can run and bend down in high heels and a tight dress, as seen in the CCTV footage.

She fell over in the takeaway. She was pissed. No one is contesting that - not even the defence.

You seem very keen on blaming the victim here. Why?

 

[smoker]

Really good post that mate, and spot on. Proven rape is rape. Ignore the sentence or curtailing of it, he is a convicted rapist. For that fact alone, he should be vilified and treat as the sick individual he is.

Luke McKormick killed two innocent children.

Marlon King has multiple convictions, many offences against women.

Do they not offend you?

She fell over in the takeaway. She was pissed. No one is contesting that - not even the defence.

You seem very keen on blaming the victim here. Why?

Somewhat later, in the hotel, she looked sober.

Keep throwing the adhominems.

 

[not spavin]

That's not what I have said there, is it?!

Suggesting he cannot get on with his life as it would "send a message to kids that it's ok" is, yes. It's a ridiculous to say that him playing football is going to in any way make young people more likely to become rapists. Absent of that non-argument, there's no other reason for him to not be allowed to get on with his life. The fact is that he has served his time - if there's going to be some sort of kangaroo court now that gets to pass a second sentence on him, then we might as well not bother with the criminal justice system at all.

There are grown ups on this thread arguing that it wasn't rape. That drunk girls are fair game. That consent is a loose term. That if a woman gets drunk, the deserve what they get.

There are grown ups - grown ups with kids - arguing that.

Now, are you telling me that a young man who sees a stadium chanting Evans' name won't conclude that Evans didn't do anything wrong?

Do you have no line? If the girl was 11, and his sentence was 6 years, would you still being saying "he served his time"?

 

[Mel Be Mine]

Luke McKormick killed two innocent children.

Marlon King has multiple convictions, many offences against women.

Do they not offend you?

They did then and do now, as does the rapist. What's your point?

 

[smoker]

There are grown ups on this thread arguing that it wasn't rape. That drunk girls are fair game. That consent is a loose term. That if a woman gets drunk, the deserve what they get.

There are grown ups - grown ups with kids - arguing that.

Now, are you telling me that a young man who sees a stadium chanting Evans' name won't conclude that Evans didn't do anything wrong?

Do you have no line? If the girl was 11, and his sentence was 6 years, would you still being saying "he served his time"?

Captain Fallacy moves on to Straw Man bashing.

 

[not spavin]

Somewhat later, in the hotel, she looked sober.

Keep throwing the adhominems.

So she wasn't drunk?

That's your logic? That she went from falling-over drunk to "agree to sex on camera with someone she hasn't met, while naked" sober in the space of a cab ride?

Mate - these aren't ad homonyms. I'm not attacking your character. I'm attacking your defending of a rapist. I think you need to accept that, rather than playing the victim. Your posts are unequivocally defending a rapist and blaming a rape victim.

Captain Fallacy moves on to Straw Man bashing.

Are you not defending a rapist and blaming the victim?

Tell me how that's not the case.

 

[Mel Be Mine]

Luke McKormick killed two innocent children.

Marlon King has multiple convictions, many offences against women.

Do they not offend you?



Somewhat later, in the hotel, she looked sober.

Keep throwing the adhominems.

They did then and do now, as does the rapist. What's your point?

 

[smoker]

So she wasn't drunk?

That's your logic? That she went from falling-over drunk to "agree to sex on camera with someone she hasn't met, while naked" sober in the space of a cab ride?

Mate - these aren't ad homonyms. I'm not attacking your character. I'm attacking your defending of a rapist. I think you need to accept that, rather than playing the victim. Your posts are unequivocally defending a rapist and blaming a rape victim.



Are you not defending a rapist and blaming the victim?

Tell me how that's not the case.

Based on what I have read and the videos I have seen I would not - as a juror - be convinced she was too drunk to know what she was doing.

This is not 'victim blaming' or being a 'rape apologist'.

If you can be arsed to dig up my past posts on the subject I started off very anti-Evans but changed my mind, the more I read on the case.

 

[Sweeper]

Now, are you telling me that a young man who sees a stadium chanting Evans' name won't conclude that Evans didn't do anything wrong?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying - he'll have his name chanted because he's scored a goal or played well, not because he's raped someone. What sort of kid is going to hear his name chanted and think "oh yeah, that chant must be because he's a rapist"?! Are you for f***ing real?! How stupid do you think kids are?

If you think that a kid is going to see him score a goal, hear the crowd cheer and arrive at the conclusion that rape is ok, then the problem is yours I'm afraid. If you're going to try and push the ridiculous "influence" angle, then what about the opposite effect - the kid who asks their mam/dad "who's that and why wasn't he playing last season?", when they get the answer "he's been in prison for over two years for raping someone" is surely far more likely to think "f***ing hell, I don't like the sound of two years in prison, I'll be sure not to rape anyone in the future!".

Do you have no line? If the girl was 11, and his sentence was 6 years, would you still being saying "he served his time"?

No, and that is a ridiculous comparison to make. The fact that you can even make it betrays the fact that you aren't considering the issue properly.

So she wasn't drunk?

That's your logic? That she went from falling-over drunk to "agree to sex on camera with someone she hasn't met, while naked" sober in the space of a cab ride?

Mate - these aren't ad homonyms. I'm not attacking your character. I'm attacking your defending of a rapist. I think you need to accept that, rather than playing the victim. Your posts are unequivocally defending a rapist and blaming a rape victim.

I don't think anyone's defending a rapist here - he's been defended in court and was convicted. I'm pretty sure we all agree that rape is very bad and rapists deserve to be punished. Having been convicted, he's served his time though so why should he continue to be punished for the rest of his life?

 

[lord of light]

Not defending a rapist = politically correct?

Really?

dont think hes defending a rapist but questioning whether he has or has not paid his debt to society. Like all other criminals - he ha and should be allowed to get on with earning his living in the way he knows how. So if he gets found to have been wrongly convicted i expect you and all the other evans haters and bandwaggoners to post up your apologies but i wont hold my breath - thats is if he is found wrongly convicted i hasten to add

 

[not spavin]

Based on what I have read and the videos I have seen I would not - as a juror - be convinced she was too drunk to know what she was doing.

This is not 'victim blaming' or being a 'rape apologist'.

If you can be arsed to dig up my past posts on the subject I started off very anti-Evans but changed my mind, the more I read on the case.

Are you reading court documents, or the arguments put forward by Evans' friends?

I can't understand how anyone can become pro-Evans if they're reading the court documents.

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying - he'll have his name chanted because he's scored a goal or played well, not because he's raped someone. What sort of kid is going to hear his name chanted and think "oh yeah, that chant must be because he's a rapist"?! Are you for f***ing real?! How stupid do you think kids are?

If you think that a kid is going to see him score a goal, hear the crowd cheer and arrive at the conclusion that rape is ok, then the problem is yours I'm afraid. If you're going to try and push the ridiculous "influence" angle, then what about the opposite effect - the kid who asks their mam/dad "who's that and why wasn't he playing last season?", when they get the answer "he's been in prison for over two years for raping someone" is surely far more likely to think "f***ing hell, I don't like the sound of two years in prison, I'll be sure not to rape anyone in the future!".

No, and that is a ridiculous comparison to make. The fact that you can even make it betrays the fact that you aren't considering the issue properly

I don't think anyone's defending a rapist here - he's been defended in court and was convicted. I'm pretty sure we all agree that rape is very bad and rapists deserve to be punished. Having been convicted, he's served his time though so why should he continue to be punished for the rest of his life?

Genuinely flabbergasted by most of that.

The fact that you think comparing rape of a 19 year old to rape of a 12 year old is "ridiculous" suggested me that you're massively underestimating just how serious rape is.

 

[mad hatter]

I don't understand why people are so upset about it to be honest. He was tried, convicted and sentenced and then served that sentence. Evans has done his time and is free to be part of our society again, which means getting a job and his profession just happens to be football. Unless you are related to the lass or know her it's none of your f***ing business what he does now he's out of prison.