MacBook or Windows Laptop?

Schmarrnbeppi said:
General work purposes mainly. Office etc.
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Depends what your work is. It'd be fine for spreadsheets etc but it'd be awful for video editing or using After Effects
Schmarrnbeppi said:
690
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that processor is about 10 years old now, the 13th gen of that chip came out earlier in the year so personally I wouldnt be paying 690 quid. If you feel itd be fine for your use then thats ok though.
 
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This argument will run for years and there are strong opinions on both sides. Ultimately people have the freedom to buy and use what they wish.

Personally I prefer the iOS operating system and I like using the Mac app to do video editing. I also write my book on my Mac Book Air when I'm on the train.
On the other hand with work I am often installing and using Oracle databases and the main software I use for work is far easier (although not easy) to install on Windows systems. So my work laptop is Windows based.

Horses for courses.
 
PTR said:
What?
You're thinking of paying 700 now for a 7 year old system?

No!
That's the type you get reconditioned on hot UK deals for about £180 quite often

Mind, shows how long even a half decent windows laptop lasts these days, after 7 years they get a clean and get resold as very decent laptops again
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Ok now I've narrowed it down to 4 I like, which is best? I should say - I'd prefer USBC charging but it's not vital and I'd prefer metal body:

Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 | i5-1135G7 | 13.5"
8 GB | 512 GB SSD | mattschwarz | WQHD | Win 11 Home | DE

Lenovo ThinkPad X1 Carbon G7 | i5-8265U | 14"
16 GB | 256 GB SSD | FHD | Tastaturbeleuchtung | Touch | Webcam | FP | Win 11 Pro | DE

HP EliteBook 840 G7 | i5-10310U | 14"
32 GB | 2 TB SSD | Webcam | Tastaturbeleuchtung | Win 11 Pro | DE

Or:

Dell Inspiron 14 2in1 with the following spec:
Prozessor
Intel® Core™ i5-1335U der 13. Generation (12 MB Cache, 10 Cores, 12 Threads, bis zu 4,60 GHz)

Betriebssystem
Windows 11 Home, Englisch, Niederländisch, Französisch, Deutsch, Italienisch

Grafikkarte
Intel® Iris® Xe Grafikkarte

Display
36,0 cm (14,0")-FHD+-Display (1.920 x 1.200), 60 Hz, 250 cd/m², weiter Betrachtungswinkel, mit Touchfunktion, ComfortView Plus

Arbeitsspeicher
8 GB, integrierter LPDDR5-Arbeitsspeicher, 4.800 MHz

Storage
512 GB-M.2-PCIe-NVMe-SSD
 
Schmarrnbeppi said:
Don't think I'd pay full price new but as a guide what would be the pros and cons of paying a perfect refurb from 2020 for example?
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Only downside is you have some of the apple quirks and the file structure etc but you can get excel and word and PowerPoint these days. Mac and apple in general are better for malware and viruses Or so I’m told.
im no expert but had computers since the 90s and the Mac has lasted longer than anything I’ve ever had. 8 years old and works like new ……………………….watch now break on me ha ha
Saying that I was forced into buying a windows laptop for work only during lockdown and that 3 years now and still working, saying that it’s used purely for business so less risk I suppose.
 
BILLY BUS PASS said:
Only downside is you have some of the apple quirks and the file structure etc but you can get excel and word and PowerPoint these days. Mac and apple in general are better for malware and viruses Or so I’m told.
im no expert but had computers since the 90s and the Mac has lasted longer than anything I’ve ever had. 8 years old and works like new ……………………….watch now break on me ha ha
Saying that I was forced into buying a windows laptop for work only during lockdown and that 3 years now and still working, saying that it’s used purely for business so less risk I suppose.
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Does i5/i7 or M1 etc make much difference?
 
errant said:
Can only speak from the feedback of the users we've rolled out mac's to, but the m1 & m2 proc's appear to be better for our users.
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At the moment I'm probably swaying towards windows and one of the 4 I mentioned above. Not sure which is best but I'll keep an eye on Macs
errant said:
Can only speak from the feedback of the users we've rolled out mac's to, but the m1 & m2 proc's appear to be better for our users.
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This was another refurb option:

Apple MacBook Pro 2020 | 13.3" | Touch Bar
i5-8257U | 8 GB | 256 GB SSD | 2 x Thunderbolt 3
 
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BILLY BUS PASS said:
Mac every time I’m still using my mac I bought in 2015 no way a windows machine would be turning on never mind be fully functioning as new.
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As I just said, I recently bought 2 2015-ish laptops, cleaned them up reinstalled the OS and passed them to relatives who are using them as new laptops.
They work great. And will do for 5+ years to come, easily.

But they weren't bargain bin £280 laptops to start with, which I'm convinced are the only windows laptops some people have ever used.

Not saying there's owt wrong with macs before anyone starts. They appear to be grand (never touched one myself, so wouldn't pass any more judgement than that)
 
Schmarrnbeppi said:
Does i5/i7 or M1 etc make much difference?
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I5/i7 are intel M1 is a Mac developed chip so on M1 you'll get longer operating system support for upgrades. It's a lot more power efficient than the I chips so the battery lasts longer and it doesn't need to be cooled anywhere near the level than an Intel chip does so the system is quieter and cooler. Won't burn your lap.

I'm still using my Macbook from 2012 and will be getting an M based one if this ever gives up the ghost
 
Schmarrnbeppi said:
Ok now I've narrowed it down to 4 I like, which is best? I should say - I'd prefer USBC charging but it's not vital and I'd prefer metal body:

Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 | i5-1135G7 | 13.5"
8 GB | 512 GB SSD | mattschwarz | WQHD | Win 11 Home | DE

Lenovo ThinkPad X1 Carbon G7 | i5-8265U | 14"
16 GB | 256 GB SSD | FHD | Tastaturbeleuchtung | Touch | Webcam | FP | Win 11 Pro | DE

HP EliteBook 840 G7 | i5-10310U | 14"
32 GB | 2 TB SSD | Webcam | Tastaturbeleuchtung | Win 11 Pro | DE

Dell Inspiron 14 2in1 with the following spec:
Prozessor
Intel® Core™ i5-1335U der 13. Generation (12 MB Cache, 10 Cores, 12 Threads, bis zu 4,60 GHz)
Intel® Iris® Xe Grafikkarte
36,0 cm (14,0")-FHD+-Display (1.920 x 1.200), 60 Hz, 250 cd/m², weiter Betrachtungswinkel, mit Touchfunktion, ComfortView Plus
8 GB, integrierter LPDDR5-Arbeitsspeicher, 4.800 MHz
512 GB-M.2-PCIe-NVMe-SSD
Click to expand...

See the bit after i5 - numbers like 8265, 1135, 10310, 1335 ?
The first 1-2 numbers are the generation. 8th, 11th, 10th, 13th. Basically every generation is a year. 14th gen has just been released. So that 8th gen is now a 6 year old part.
I've recently supplied 1 7th and 1 8th gen laptop to family - so I'm not saying there's a massive issue with that - but it is something to be mindful of in terms of performance and price.

Also, the next number generally tells you how "high" they are in the range. There's no specific difference between an i3 and an i9 CPU, its a sliding scale where they add more components and also use "stronger" chips that can take more speed. For example, I have a 12th Gen desktop i5 CPU, but its the lowest in the range - the 12400. The lowest i7 is 12700, but there's a i5 12600 that's pretty close to the i7 - you can only use the i3/i5/i7 as a starting guide.


Here's the benchmark scores, in order of generation - note the steady increase
Intel Core i5-8265U @ 1.60GHz - 6018
Intel Core i5-10310U @ 1.70GHz - 6465
Intel Core i5-1135G7 @ 2.40GHz - 9912
Intel Core i5-1335U - 17631

You can see that 13th gen part is almost double the speed of anything else on the list.
 
Schmarrnbeppi said:
This was another refurb option:

Apple MacBook Pro 2020 | 13.3" | Touch Bar
i5-8257U | 8 GB | 256 GB SSD | 2 x Thunderbolt 3
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thats pretty much the same as my macbook pro I use for browsing in the living room, shopping and other light stuff. its from 2016 and it's fine, the operating system won't go past Montana but it's fine for light use.

I've got a MacPro Studio as my main one
 
Horace Cope said:
I5/i7 are intel M1 is a Mac developed chip so on M1 you'll get longer operating system support for upgrades.
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Are you joking?
Intel x64 and x86 are the most compatible last-forever CPUs ever made in the consumer space. You can install Windows OS from 2003 on any x86 CPU from today. If you look at AMD Ryzen, you can install Windows NT on them still - that's from 1996 !!
And conversely you can install Windows 11 on a 14 year old Intel Pentium 4 !

Horace Cope said:
It's a lot more power efficient than the I chips so the battery lasts longer and it doesn't need to be cooled anywhere near the level than an Intel chip does so the system is quieter and cooler. Won't burn your lap.
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Just on this, I don't think many people know that the size of the apple chips are huge. Therefore expensive.
The M2 Max is 672mm^2
The i9-12900 is 207mm^2

You can fit 9 of them in the same space!

Not denying they are very powerful AND energy efficient though. But it is at the expense of, well, expense.
 
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PTR said:
Are you joking?
Intel x64 and x86 are the most compatible last-forever CPUs ever made in the consumer space. You can install Windows OS from 2003 on any x86 CPU from today. If you look at AMD Ryzen, you can install Windows NT on them still - that's from 1996 !!
And conversely you can install Windows 11 on a 14 year old Intel Pentium 4 !
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Yeah but realistically nobody wants to do that on a laptop. The arm instruction set of the M1/M2/M3 is the future of mobile computing. 99.9% of mobiles run on arm for it's efficiency that x64 can't match. For mobile computing arm is the future even Microsoft know that

blogs.windows.com

Windows launching Arm Advisory Service for developers

Many developers believe creating apps for Windows on Arm is difficult, but developing for Arm is easier than you think, and Microsoft is here to help! It is my pleasure to announce a new
blogs.windows.com blogs.windows.com
PTR said:
Just on this, I don't think many people know that the size of the apple chips are huge. Therefore expensive.
The M2 Max is 672mm^2
The i9-12900 is 207mm^2

You can fit 9 of them in the same space!

Not denying they are very powerful AND energy efficient though. But it is at the expense of, well, expense.
Click to expand...

Presumably that size of the M2 max chip you're quoting is the CPU / GPU / RAM and storage combined. On a single chip
 
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Horace Cope said:
Yeah but realistically nobody wants to do that on a laptop. The arm instruction set of the M1/M2/M3 is the future of mobile computing. 99.9% of mobiles run on arm for it's efficiency that x64 can't match. For mobile computing arm is the future even Microsoft know that

blogs.windows.com

Windows launching Arm Advisory Service for developers

Many developers believe creating apps for Windows on Arm is difficult, but developing for Arm is easier than you think, and Microsoft is here to help! It is my pleasure to announce a new
blogs.windows.com blogs.windows.com
Click to expand...
ARM is great, no doubt.
Microsoft have looked into ARM many times over the years. They've made versions for ARM since Windows 8 iirc.

Just to confirm, I'm not trying to have an Apple/Non Apple argument here. Their chips are really cool. But its still worth making a few points here and there.
 
PTR said:
See the bit after i5 - numbers like 8265, 1135, 10310, 1335 ?
The first 1-2 numbers are the generation. 8th, 11th, 10th, 13th. Basically every generation is a year. 14th gen has just been released. So that 8th gen is now a 6 year old part.
I've recently supplied 1 7th and 1 8th gen laptop to family - so I'm not saying there's a massive issue with that - but it is something to be mindful of in terms of performance and price.

Also, the next number generally tells you how "high" they are in the range. There's no specific difference between an i3 and an i9 CPU, its a sliding scale where they add more components and also use "stronger" chips that can take more speed. For example, I have a 12th Gen desktop i5 CPU, but its the lowest in the range - the 12400. The lowest i7 is 12700, but there's a i5 12600 that's pretty close to the i7 - you can only use the i3/i5/i7 as a starting guide.


Here's the benchmark scores, in order of generation - note the steady increase
Intel Core i5-8265U @ 1.60GHz - 6018
Intel Core i5-10310U @ 1.70GHz - 6465
Intel Core i5-1135G7 @ 2.40GHz - 9912
Intel Core i5-1335U - 17631

You can see that 13th gen part is almost double the speed of anything else on the list.
Click to expand...
So if you picked from that list what is best which would you go for?
 

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