EU chief warns 'no possibility' of UK reducing immigration

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Lambchops said:
:D what benefits do you think it would have? Sunderland would be fucked as a City straight away as Nissan would be the first to pull the plug and move into a EU country. Believe it or not the Uk is not the big powerhouse it was - there's no industry left - and any of the major firms that are based in the Uk will sharp move to the continent as dealing within the EU is a lot easier. A trade agreement of some description will be drawn up I have no doubt but I can't imagine EU members being favourable to a country that basically told them to go and fuck themselves
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You're miles wide if the mark for my money. Have a read of Daniel Hannan MEP in the mail today for a more eloquent argument than I could ever muster.

Nissan said the same about joining the euro.
 


Lambchops said:
I have no idea about UKIP mate I don't follow it - come on though, where is the Uk's industry? what makes it a major power? Thatcher fucked all that up and the country is paying the price 30 years later still - call centres, thats what the Uk has now - f***ing call centres and even they are being outsoursed elsewhere because its expensive to run in the Uk


to be fair the whole of europe is fucked to be honest
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Exactly, which is the point I was alluding too. the IMF thinks Britain "will outpace" the rest of the G7 this year, so somewhere something is right.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29517660

In fact the weakness in the Eurozone is now affecting our output, useless f***ing twats :evil:
 
Brexit said:
You're miles wide if the mark for my money. Have a read of Daniel Hannan MEP in the mail today for a more eloquent argument than I could ever muster.

Nissan said the same about joining the euro.
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we'll have to agree to disagree on this one mate - to be honest I can't see the Uk pulling out

shepherd88 said:
Exactly, which is the point I was alluding too. the IMF thinks Britain "will outpace" the rest of the G7 this year, so somewhere something is right.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29517660

In fact the weakness in the Eurozone is now affecting our output, useless f***ing twats :evil:
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Aye, germany and france are fucked aren't they - to short-term a model
 
Lambchops said:
:D what benefits do you think it would have? Sunderland would be fucked as a City straight away as Nissan would be the first to pull the plug and move into a EU country. Believe it or not the Uk is not the big powerhouse it was - there's no industry left - and any of the major firms that are based in the Uk will sharp move to the continent as dealing within the EU is a lot easier. A trade agreement of some description will be drawn up I have no doubt but I can't imagine EU members being favourable to a country that basically told them to go and fuck themselves
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Sad state of a affairs when we're having to sacrifice democracy due to being blackmailed by crappy multinational companies, who we already have to bribe to get them to set up their factories here in the first place.

There's no reason why we wouldn't be able to set up a trade arrangement (which is what the EU was originally for), unless the other EU countries refuse out of spite, in which case we are really being held to ransom. But I'd expect the failing economies of Europe would have little choice but to trade with us as they do now.
 
CEF said:
Sad state of a affairs when we're having to sacrifice democracy due to being blackmailed by crappy multinational companies, who we already have to bribe to get them to set up their factories here in the first place.

There's no reason why we wouldn't be able to set up a trade arrangement (which is what the EU was originally for), unless the other EU countries refuse out of spite, in which case we are really being held to ransom. But I'd expect the failing economies of Europe would have little choice but to trade with us as they do now.
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big risk to take
 
Lambchops said:
we'll have to agree to disagree on this one mate - to be honest I can't see the Uk pulling out



Aye, germany and france are fucked aren't they - to short-term a model
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I urge you to read the article I mentioned, it may really surprise you.

Britain will leave, the EU in its current form will fail. There is no desire for a superstate apart from the fascists in charge. I just want it to be sooner rather than later.
 
heres another one to throw in there (as I know that people are debating this "WTF would happen if UK left the EU";))

If the UK left, theres 100s of British citizens living in Europe still receiving UK benefits that they would no longer receive. Might tempt some to come back.

There are (in the completely opposite vein to what some media and papers complain about us doing) kids living with one parent in the UK where the other European country pays the benefit for that family (some cases more than the UK would pay). that'd cease if the UK left.

Just wanted to throw that out there and see what happens! ;):lol:
 
Brexit said:
In a few ways.

First of all I don't see maybe a few million people having to fill a few forms in or choosing to move back to the country of their birth as much of a sacrifice for securing a much brighter and more democratic future for the 64m already here and generations to come.

I understand there are plenty of ex pat Brit pensioners that you think will come back and burden the NHS. If they did come back, which I can't imagine Spain would make them do, then I see a shit load of British Government pension money coming back into our economy and not abroad to Spain's. Also, immigrants tend to chuck out kids at a higher rate than others in this country which puts added pressure onto many, many public services.

You mention this 3 month visa thing regularly but fail to mention that for non-EU immigrants here already that that is not the case these days. Things have moved on from then and are different.

Your point about immigrants not wanting to stay in a country where they aren't like is offensive bullshit. Wanting to control numbers and quality is totally different. You appear to like putting the general British public down. That annoys me.
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It won't be just a matter of "filling a few forms" in though will it. British people will have no automatic right to either live or work in a European country for starters. They would then have to sort out visas and permissions for both. In order to do that they would need to satisfy the laws of that country. See Foreign Labour Laws of each state. Employers will not be keen on hiring or retaining non EU citizens as it will involve a lot more bureaucracy and red tape for them. They will hire EU citizens who will be a lot less complicated. Many Brits work in Europe without formal contracts and will therefore not meet a requirement for a work visa and consequently permission to live there. The whole income taxes due could become a nightmare for non EU members working in Europe. Property ownership for Brits in Europe could also become very complicated and subjected to more taxes. It is very much a matter of debate whether British people would have a "brighter" future as a citizen of a country choosing to isolate itself on the periphery of Europe outside the collective economy. I'm not at all sure how UKIP's stated aim of withdrawing from the European Convention on Human Rights would enhance democracy in Britain either.
Without a doubt many Pensioners will return simply because their pension will frozen at the current level if Britain leaves the EU and the value go down year on year. In 2007/8 when the crisis hit in Spain many pensioners were forced to move back as their pensions decreased in value. Many property owners will not be able to sell their properties due to very stagnant markets. It will not only be the NHS which will feel thw weight of the return but also social services, housing and ancillary services.
The "kids being chucked out" by immigrant parents are generally from parents who work and pay taxes to sustain them and their families in their communities. Immigrants from Europe are substantial net contributors to the Exchequer. So as working tax paying people are leaving they will be replaced with economically inactive people who will use far more resources.
The three month visa was the norm right up until the freedom of movement came in and that was as a member of the EU . Someone like @AndrewP would be able to tell you better what their non EU wife has to go through in order to live and work in Britain a lot better than i can. I get the impression it is both costly and bureaucratic, certainly more than filling in a couple of forms. The same could apply for Brits wanting to work in Europe.
All the above (and i'm sure there is more i haven't touched on) will ensure a lot of chaos for British people and result in a lot returning.
All the above will also apply to Europeans living and working in Britain. I'm not sure what you find offensive about Europeans wanting to leave a country where it will be very complicated to live and work whose population has voted to leave Europe and which is turning in on itself with xenophobia. Personally i would do the same in their situation. If by me arguing the case for Britain staying in the EU IS "putting the general British public down" then you need to have a word with yourself. I think what annoys you is having your soundbite politics taken to pieces and shown for the rubbish that they are.
 
CEF said:
Sad state of a affairs when we're having to sacrifice democracy due to being blackmailed by crappy multinational companies, who we already have to bribe to get them to set up their factories here in the first place.

There's no reason why we wouldn't be able to set up a trade arrangement (which is what the EU was originally for), unless the other EU countries refuse out of spite, in which case we are really being held to ransom. But I'd expect the failing economies of Europe would have little choice but to trade with us as they do now.
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Problem is the same as the Jocks had, the unknown.

The Big Chiefs at Nissan have confirmed that if we pull out of the EU they will look at other oppotunitys elsewhere.
Nissan face massive competition from other European plants ( Renault) to build new models, I have no doubt at all that Nissan would slowly pull the plug and any new models would not come our way.
the failing economies as you state would gladly take our business but not our products.
 
Lambchops said:

what about us ex-pats who live and work elsewhere in the EU - if the Uk pulls out of the EU then where will that leave us? stuck having to apply for visa's every 3 months - it could split families up

Also, when you fancy a weeks holiday in Spain or elsewhere on the continent whats to stop them making you apply for a visa for that?
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choosing to move back to the country of their birth as much of a sacrifice for securing a much brighter and more democratic future for the 64m already here and generations to come.
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It would be for the greater good of the nation man. ;)
 
El Matador said:
It won't be just a matter of "filling a few forms" in though will it. British people will have no automatic right to either live or work in a European country for starters. They would then have to sort out visas and permissions for both. In order to do that they would need to satisfy the laws of that country. See Foreign Labour Laws of each state. Employers will not be keen on hiring or retaining non EU citizens as it will involve a lot more bureaucracy and red tape for them. They will hire EU citizens who will be a lot less complicated. Many Brits work in Europe without formal contracts and will therefore not meet a requirement for a work visa and consequently permission to live there. The whole income taxes due could become a nightmare for non EU members working in Europe. Property ownership for Brits in Europe could also become very complicated and subjected to more taxes. It is very much a matter of debate whether British people would have a "brighter" future as a citizen of a country choosing to isolate itself on the periphery of Europe outside the collective economy. I'm not at all sure how UKIP's stated aim of withdrawing from the European Convention on Human Rights would enhance democracy in Britain either.
Without a doubt many Pensioners will return simply because their pension will frozen at the current level if Britain leaves the EU and the value go down year on year. In 2007/8 when the crisis hit in Spain many pensioners were forced to move back as their pensions decreased in value. Many property owners will not be able to sell their properties due to very stagnant markets. It will not only be the NHS which will feel thw weight of the return but also social services, housing and ancillary services.
The "kids being chucked out" by immigrant parents are generally from parents who work and pay taxes to sustain them and their families in their communities. Immigrants from Europe are substantial net contributors to the Exchequer. So as working tax paying people are leaving they will be replaced with economically inactive people who will use far more resources.
The three month visa was the norm right up until the freedom of movement came in and that was as a member of the EU . Someone like @AndrewP would be able to tell you better what their non EU wife has to go through in order to live and work in Britain a lot better than i can. I get the impression it is both costly and bureaucratic, certainly more than filling in a couple of forms. The same could apply for Brits wanting to work in Europe.
All the above (and i'm sure there is more i haven't touched on) will ensure a lot of chaos for British people and result in a lot returning.
All the above will also apply to Europeans living and working in Britain. I'm not sure what you find offensive about Europeans wanting to leave a country where it will be very complicated to live and work whose population has voted to leave Europe and which is turning in on itself with xenophobia. Personally i would do the same in their situation. If by me arguing the case for Britain staying in the EU IS "putting the general British public down" then you need to have a word with yourself. I think what annoys you is having your soundbite politics taken to pieces and shown for the rubbish that they are.
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Ok, you disagree and you're entitled to do that but is there any reason to be an absolute arsehole in the process? I try to be civil as best I can but can't be bothered any more. Clash of online personalities or whatever but I will not be bothering any more. Hope whatever happens works out for you.

Lambchops said:
If he thinks I'm leaving my wife and kid for the greater good of Britain he's mistaken like - and how many others would be in the same position?
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Fuck sake man.
 
Lambchops said:
big risk to take
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A hell of a gamble with everyones future.
Lambchops said:
If he thinks I'm leaving my wife and kid for the greater good of Britain he's mistaken like - and how many others would be in the same position?
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I left to get away from a wife. :D I ain't going back.
My bairns have spent two thirds of their lives moving around Europe and the thought of not being able to continue doing so freely does not impress them one little bit.
Leaving Europe would take Britain back 40 years in terms of political, economic and social isolation in my opinion.
 
El Matador said:
A hell of a gamble with everyones future.

I left to get away from a wife. :D I ain't going back.
My bairns have spent two thirds of their lives moving around Europe and the thought of not being able to continue doing so freely does not impress them one little bit.
Leaving Europe would take Britain back 40 years in terms of political, economic and social isolation in my opinion.
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Its one of the great things of being in the EU - the freedom of movement is fantastic
 
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