New day, new migrants.

[AFCSR6]

So you agree with global capitalism or disagree?

I have done OK for myself out of it, so I can't say I disagree with it as such, but I don't like the principal behind it. Not sure why that matters the point I was making is that people complain that cheap labour coming over here reduces wages for others, but that is exactly what global capitalism and free markets are all about. What's your thoughts on it?

 

[Monty Pigeon]

Presumably you are talking specifically about the refugees affecting the EU, which mainly come from Syria? Well apart from the geographical factors of actually getting there, countries there already do take a lot more refuges than we do.

http://www.unhcr.org/pages/4b17be9b6.html

Logon or register to see this image

The Ummah isn't supposed to take geography into account. All Muslims are supposed to be obliged to help other Muslims.

That table doesn't tell the whole story. Yes, Malaysia has 99,381 (mainly Vietnamese) refugees. Where are most of them? They're in appalling detention camps. Thailand doesn't have a great humanitarian record on that score either. So 'taking a lot more refugees than we do' doesn't make them paragons of virtue.

 

[Brexit]

I strongly urge people to read this http://www.conservativehome.com/the...t-hand-theres-no-way-the-eu-can-solve-it.html It's the best piece I've read on the crisis so far.

 

[Red N White Baron]

Logon or register to see this image

People keep using that as a stick.
Their disgusting parents put that kid on a rickety f***ing boat to escape exactly what they'll bring to us. Stoneage misery.
Why the fuck is it ok to post pictures of dead kids now, yet you'll be murdered for drawing a picture of the very thing that caused it.

 

[Harry Angstrom]

I have done OK for myself out of it, so I can't say I disagree with it as such, but I don't like the principal behind it. Not sure why that matters the point I was making is that people complain that cheap labour coming over here reduces wages for others, but that is exactly what global capitalism and free markets are all about. What's your thoughts on it?

I think allowing so many people over here in the last 30 years has been a disgrace. The social engineering is beyond anything that could have been envisaged a generation ago.

We have thrown the baby out with the bathwater. But people seem happy with it so I just get on with life and try and avoid most of the crap.

People keep using that as a stick.
Their disgusting parents put that kid on a rickety f***ing boat to escape exactly what they'll bring to us. Stoneage misery.
Why the fuck is it ok to post pictures of dead kids now, yet you'll be murdered for drawing a picture of the very thing that caused it.

Sorry mate but you are coming out with such utter crap I'm embarrassed we have a connection through supporting the same team.

 

[monkeytassle]

I think allowing so many people over here in the last 30 years has been a disgrace. The social engineering is beyond anything that could have been envisaged a generation ago.

We have thrown the baby out with the bathwater. But people seem happy with it so I just get on with life and try and avoid most of the crap.



Sorry mate but you are coming out with such utter crap I'm embarrassed we have a connection through supporting the same team.

It's not just a UK issue. It's a very global problem

 

[Hulkster]

Logon or register to see this image

How could we have stopped this happening?

How could we have ensured the safety of that child and indeed everyone else making the crossing?

I would genuinely like to know because I would desperately like us to be able to stop this sort of thing from happening.

I see two main options: we either try to stop people from making the journey in the first place, or we provide the transport ourselves.

If we provide the transport ourselves we will have to be braced for millions, and we will also have to secure ports in Syria and other places via military action.

 

[AFCSR6]

I think allowing so many people over here in the last 30 years has been a disgrace. The social engineering is beyond anything that could have been envisaged a generation ago.

We have thrown the baby out with the bathwater. But people seem happy with it so I just get on with life and try and avoid most of the crap.

Thatcher's Britain.

 

[smoker]

I don't understand why we are being asked to choose between two extremes:

1. Do nothing, turn them back, let them die etc.
2. Let them in, give them ILR and - ultimately - British citizenship and put further strain on infrastructure, crime, cultural identity etc

How about:
A. We deal with ISIS, making Syria a place where they want to remain (hand wringers won't like that)
B. Remove ILR, give them temporary leave to remain, in designated safe areas within the EU, and return them home when their country is safe
C. Put up some money to house them in decent and safe conditions closer to home (ie Turkey, Lebanon), and send in EU/UN military to protect them.

 

[---Nemo---]

I genuinely wonder how many members of the ruling families in Saudi, Qatar, Bahrain, UAE etc are looking at that photo and thinking, " you know what, these are fellow Muslims suffering as a direct result of our policies in the region, perhaps we should do something about it".

It's so easy to forget how complicit they are in this whole mess.

Indeed. The Saudis in particular have blood on their hands.

 

[Harry Angstrom]

It's not just a UK issue. It's a very global problem

i am aware of this. I am also aware that, like global warming, there will not be a consensus against the way we are doing things. It's just a sham that we cannot order society differently. Maybe Corbyn will sort it out

Thatcher's Britain.

I would say Blair made it much worse. He was Bob Paisley to Thatcher's Shankly.

 

[---Nemo---]

I don't understand why we are being asked to choose between two extremes:

1. Do nothing, turn them back, let them die etc.
2. Let them in, give them ILR and - ultimately - British citizenship and put further strain on infrastructure, crime, cultural identity etc

How about:
A. We deal with ISIS, making Syria a place where they want to remain (hand wringers won't like that)
B. Remove ILR, give them temporary leave to remain, in designated safe areas within the EU, and return them home when their country is safe
C. Put up some money to house them in decent and safe conditions closer to home (ie Turkey, Lebanon), and send in EU/UN military to protect them.

We're already in there with C. We're contributing more cash than any other EU nation.

 

[Hair Flick]

I would say Blair made it much worse. He was Bob Paisley to Thatcher's Shankly.

A brilliant yet horrible analogy.

 

[monkeytassle]

i am aware of this. I am also aware that, like global warming, there will not be a consensus against the way we are doing things. It's just a sham that we cannot order society differently. Maybe Corbyn will sort it out



I would say Blair made it much worse. He was Bob Paisley to Thatcher's Shankly.

We can try and order society differently of course. It just won't last because, well you know what I think of humans.

 

[Red N White Baron]

I think allowing so many people over here in the last 30 years has been a disgrace. The social engineering is beyond anything that could have been envisaged a generation ago.

We have thrown the baby out with the bathwater. But people seem happy with it so I just get on with life and try and avoid most of the crap.



Sorry mate but you are coming out with such utter crap I'm embarrassed we have a connection through supporting the same team.

I'm not arsed in the slightest mate.
They weren't forced into paying thousands to put their kids on a dingy. His brother died as well.
I'd say that was down to pretty poor parenting like.

 

[fatha]

I don't understand why we are being asked to choose between two extremes:

1. Do nothing, turn them back, let them die etc.
2. Let them in, give them ILR and - ultimately - British citizenship and put further strain on infrastructure, crime, cultural identity etc

How about:
A. We deal with ISIS, making Syria a place where they want to remain (hand wringers won't like that)
B. Remove ILR, give them temporary leave to remain, in designated safe areas within the EU, and return them home when their country is safe
C. Put up some money to house them in decent and safe conditions closer to home (ie Turkey, Lebanon), and send in EU/UN military to protect them.

Great post

 

[Harry Angstrom]

I'm not arsed in the slightest mate.
They weren't forced into paying thousands to put their kids on a dingy. His brother died as well.
I'd say that was down to pretty poor parenting like.

I know you aren't. I just thought I'd tell you.

You are f***ing warped.

 

[smoker]

We're already in there with C. We're contributing more cash than any other EU nation.

Apologies for SEBness.

Would be good if other EU countries did this, rather than passing on the problem to a third party. EU referendum is going to be a walkover for OUT at this rate.

 

[Harry Angstrom]

We can try and order society differently of course. It just won't last because, well you know what I think of humans.

I do

your view is probably quite close to the truth.

 

[Hulkster]

I don't understand why we are being asked to choose between two extremes:

1. Do nothing, turn them back, let them die etc.
2. Let them in, give them ILR and - ultimately - British citizenship and put further strain on infrastructure, crime, cultural identity etc

How about:
A. We deal with ISIS, making Syria a place where they want to remain (hand wringers won't like that)
B. Remove ILR, give them temporary leave to remain, in designated safe areas within the EU, and return them home when their country is safe
C. Put up some money to house them in decent and safe conditions closer to home (ie Turkey, Lebanon), and send in EU/UN military to protect them.

How do we deal with ISIS and make Syria a place people don't want to leave?

We would need to launch a full scale invasion and occupation of Syria, defeating both ISIS and the Assad government.

Our armed forces might be capable of an initial invasion but they certainly wouldn't be be able to hold the territory and make it safe. We'd have to introduce conscription and send our best and brightest to serve over there for years to come. And if course the invasion and occupation would probably create a lot more death and suffering than it could ever hope to prevent.